In Arizona there is actually a tax credit for RWH equipment I forget what percentage but it should help with the roughly $1300 we spent on all the components which are:

2 x 4 x 6.5ft tanks (galvanized culverts, capacity approximately 500 gal each, about $400+ ea.)

2 x 10ft x 3in sticks of ABS pipe

6 x 2ft lengths of 1in PVC pipe and assorted elbows

2 x Boiler pressure relief valves

ABS and PVC glue

1 gallon white latex hose paint

1 gallon Drylok concrete sealer

22 80lb bags of concrete

3 tubes of Cet Seal low VOC sealant and adhesive

Made to order flat cistern lids 50″ x 3″ (almost as much as the barrels themselves)

1000 gallons of rainwater !?

Well, that’s the idea. I missed monsoon season and there where a couple of occasions where the barrels where in and concreted, but not sealed, and where sitting in ankle deep water on the outside, but bone dry on the inside it was quite ironic.

But yes, 1000 gallons of rainwater (probably more like 850+) right now one tank sits at about 1/4 full, as I capped the other one off because I still haven’t sealed it. Gosh I’m lazy.

I figured my current garden uses about 8 gallons of water during summer months, and I plan on having many more plants in the future (right now it’s about 14-16 in the ground and about 15 in pots) I think 12 gallons per day isn’t an extreme summer number and I should prepare for it.

900 gal / 12gpb = 75 days of water.

Of course that number depends on rainfall and how much I actually use, also not including the additional 60 gallon ish storage I have on other tanks hooked up. I can’t even imagine a scenario where we’d have no utility water; but it doesn’t mean I shouldn’t think about it. Potable water storage isn’t a bad idea in addition to plant water.

Drinking rainwater is a tricky business I haven’t fully looked into yet but I’m assuming that it involves lots of filtering, UV lights, possible some tablets and boiling; something else I should do before it’s actually necessary.

Rainwater harvesting saves!

Money. Time. Energy and of course WATER.

Water costs money, pumping it to your house takes time and energy, vast amounts in fact, one of the main energy users in Tucson is water pumping. And where does that energy come from ? a coal fired plant that is evaporating acre-feet of what substance in order to produce power ? WATER.

As you can see the water, energy and emissions savings are huge over the life of a rainwater system.
There are many things you can do before even considering a PV system for your home, solar hot water and rainwater harvesting are 2 of the simplest (beyond changing to CFL bulbs) and cheapest ways to conserve energy.

Enough talk, Pictures !

Setting up the pipes that are underneath the barrels. This is a bottom feed system, the feed pipe basically becomes your downspout, in this case a 3″ ABS pipe and will stay filled with water on the side of your house up to the level of the barrel.

I think bottom feed systems look better than top feed.

Moving the barrels is a pretty big task, they weigh about 180lbs a piece and some of the edges can be pretty sharp.
I welded up some 3/8″ rebar into handles and used load straps to secure them to the barrels, enabling 2 people to lift them vertically into place.

I poured concrete after the barrels where in place, I prefer this method to pouring a slab and then setting the barrels.
Even though this method is probably harder, I think you buy a lot less concrete and actually get a more secure footing as you can pour up to a desired measurement rather than having to push the barrel into the concrete.

I also placed some rebar stakes into the ground and bent them over for additional security in conjunction with several CMU blocks to displace some concrete, and a section of wire fencing laid in on top to help protect against cracking.

One major drawback to this method though is the spatter it creates. You can just paint over it, but I cleaned off most of it before I sealed the concrete, sealed the barrel seam and then painted over were the seam was.

Useful link: http://www.harvestingrainwater.com/ – Rainwater Harvesting for Drylands and Beyond by Brad Lancaster

I commented (also repeated below … well, it’s probably more of a rant, I have a habit of commenting more on other comments than the articles/letters)

The letter is a bit short on details, and could be categorized as a general vague plea, but it’s hard not to sound like that when you’re constricted to 300 words. It’s a drop in the bucket compared to the torrent of information needed when we talk about such issues. One snide commenter framed the letter as such, short on details/solutions (while providing none of his own) so what is this ?

We have a well meaning letter written by the head of the NRDC no less ! that is so easy to brush off because it is so short and vague, providing no concrete solutions, only hints of them. And I agree we should GUT the CAFE bullshit and replace it with fuel efficiency standards with teeth. It’s nice to say that, but the details are the hard part.

You know why ? because the details say; We should drive less. We should drive smaller if possible. We should not base an entire economy on the price of a single commodity. We should not expect economic growth to continue onwards and upwards, we should expect that it might go sideways, or even in reverse and we should prepare for such. We should expect non-conventional sources of oil to really shit all over our environment.

Those are the hard, really jagged, no sugar coating realizations that the letter doesn’t touch on in great detail, and that the commenter doesn’t really want to hear about. QOTD by me: Nobody want’s to put the pieces of this puzzle together because at the end you don’t get a pretty picture.

Both sides of the isle are paying lip service. The greeny liberals and the hard line business conservatives. Both groups have members that really don’t get it, or can’t express it in a way that will get read by a vast number of people.

The problem is word logistics. Getting the right words into an audience’s head’s at the right pace, in the right form and at the right time is incredibly tricky.  Having said that I still want to have a crack at it; I really want to write an op ed for my local paper on energy. But alas, getting a letter published was hard as nails.

Maybe some more coherent thoughts than these below might have a chance, but hey, do you want that turd sugar coated or not ?

—-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-  —-

I’m not sure “sparking global warming” could be a comment attributed to the KXL, warming will occour with or without it, but with it, it could be several degrees worse in the next hundred years.

Eric, back up your statements with scientific opinion, links / literature and I’ll happily read them, I welcome a good learning experience.

In the meantime I’ll introduce you to our energy reality in the coming decades; The opening up of Iraqi oil beyond its borders, the instability in Libya, and the Keystone XL have one thing in common: The low hanging fruit in the oil game is GONE. Energy costs will increase whether they are conventional, unconventional or “green”. Leaving oil isn’t a choice that greenies will push upon you; it’s going to happen regardless.

The same people that will tell you the Keystone XL is good for America will in the same breath tell you Peak Oil theory is nothing but. In the same vein the war in Iraq is good for America, a future, happily “growing” America. We are still attempting to ensure a supply of cheap oil to a addicted populace.

When the Saudi wells run dry, or they hit an export peak, we’ll be all right, we have the KXL ! wooh !
Except that tarsands aren’t like sweet light crude pumped from the Saudi’s, Iraqi’s or Libyans. Your beloved elixir of growth will be a shadow of it’s former self, requiring millions more BTU’s to extract and refine. The ONLY thing that tarsands actually bring is more addiction at a higher cost.

While conservatives bleat on about jobs and fiscal conservatism they’ll happily let us continue the most unhealthy habit which will most likely lead to collapse from a greater height (delay a transition, and we only hurt ourselves) while energy costs will increase anyway; while the fat cats get fatter.

And Liberals will bleat at the president and sec. clinton, still believing that they are A. on their side and B. could make a blind bit of difference. We need some guts in this area to say the least. We should be knocking down Charlie and Dave Koch’s door and asking for our country back.

This is just another rant about oil, war and un-sustainability of empire brought on by a slightly biased article and one fairly ignorant reader letter in my local paper. It started out as a reply letter but it won’t get printed so here it is >.<

Recently I read Richard Brinkly’s peice on the debt ceiling discussion, <a member of the Saddlebrooke Republican club no less> and a letter from Henry Sheetz stating he’s unhappy with Obama.  (apparently Henry was born in 2008 as he specifically labels ‘Bama as “Worst President Ever” Let the Bush bashing begin …)

<”I dread to think what Obama would have done if 9/11 happened on his watch?” -

I’m glad you asked, depending on his resolve against the military industrial complex, which I haven’t really seen much of as a president, but as a senator he voted against it, we wouldn’t have invaded Iraq and we’d be in a much better position today financially for it.

But, you’re falling into a trap. Government figureheads are meaningless distractions, whining about which one does a better job misses the point; each one is a product of our willingness to be lied to as long as we have security and liberty. That will not change, so the results don’t change.>

I hate to break it to both these guys, but almost anything that the Dems or Republicans do is meaningless. They are almost worse than any kind of distraction I can think of.
Lady Gaga ? *shudder*

Most of the work that happens in the halls of congress is a little out of touch with reality, and in turn it distorts our understanding of reality. We sometimes willfully accept it and sometimes we don’t.

The reality is the unsustainable nature of the American Empire in which we live, we must have learnt that 2 quasi-unexplainable wars costing billions have wreaked havoc at home and is one of the biggest reasons why we are where we are today.

Quasi-unexplainable ? everyone has a different opinion on why we are in Iraq and Afghanistan, they’ll fall into a few
different catagories; Security, democracy building, defeating Al-Q and the Q’s.

Then there are a few more which really get a bit closer to what some might term the truth; Oil, natural resources, Still incomplete Caspian sea pipeline deals, opium production, strategic presence and economic subjugation of middle eastern powers. ( How much money (oil) will the western world be asking from Iraq as a back scratch ? Just how long can the Saudi’s keep up their excess capacity ? )

Now these are never publicly acknowledged overt reasons for why we go to war, and the compartmentalized nature of our society means we don’t get the whole picture which leads great swaths of the public to literally not give a shit. Business as usual.

They might be termed fringe benefits. Fringe benefits which really do help us a lot. Opening Iraq’s oil supply will one day be viewed as one of the most essential actions of the 21st century by “dumb growth” addicted historians and economists. It’s a good thing we kill and die so the US economy, (by this time if you haven’t realized it’s a war economy whose GDP relies so heavily on the price of oil it’s just not funny) can sustain a growth rate of 3% or more.

It’s not so much that oil comes to us from unstable places, which right now from Iraq it really doesn’t but how much oil is on the market to maintain a low price, a future low price at that.

Ever wonder how much the illegal drug trade adds to the economy ? Look that one up.

All this to sustain us. All of this effort outlayed so that we can achieve our meager security and liberty; both of which will
hit the fan when, we realize, as the people in power realized a few decades ago; the elixir of growth gets scarce.

But go ahead. Keep asking those in power dumb questions;  they won’t tell you the truth anyway. Don’t look directly to government figure heads for answers get wise on you’re own and you’ll quickly realize there are
many scary factors that are beyond their control, and certainly beyond your own. Welcome to the collapse.

This post brought to you by ignorance, half truths, sun burn and back pain.

I just wrote this and then proceeded to read this from the Post Carbon Institute’s Richard Heinberg. Highly recommended reading and a lot better written

The day of the shooting of Gabrielle Giffords, her staff members and all those gathered to witness our democracy in action, the bit that we like to think works, when congress members actually appear to hear the concerns of their district. Gabrielle was doing her job, one she loved and felt privileged to be able to do. I remember her consistent thanks after the election last year; “I’m honored to represent Southern Arizona”

The whole community in Tucson is in mourning, and hoping that the injured congresswoman can recover from her serious injuries.

Success and Failure

I keep hearing great praise for the way all involved responded to this horrific event, from the heros who prevented further death by subduing Jared Loughner, to the medical evac teams and the trauma personnel at UMC. That is the success we can take away from this, but it’s little consolation.

The failure of course can be drawn from the months leading up to this event. September and November 2010. Loughner was removed from a Pima Community College class, after he consistently disrupted classmates with ranting and odd behavior, even driving some to drop the class fearing their safety. The teacher said he watched Loughner like a hawk, watching to see if he was getting ready to draw a weapon.

After he was removed from campus, the college sent a letter to his family stating he could return to his studies after seeking help from a certified mental health professional.

This apparently fell on deaf ears. We have no way of knowing if Loughners parents read the letter, or to what degree they took an interest in his mental health, but in November 2010 he purchased a firearm. Lets think about that a minute. You can’t attend class, because your classmates are fearing for their safety; you’re disrupting the learning environment and even making the teacher uncomfortable. But heck, you can buy a Glock 19 and 3 31 round magazines no problem.

This is our biggest failure as a community, as a state and as a nation. There is no system which allows red flags to appear in information that gun retailers are able to look at warnings from institutions on mental health or death threats, educational or otherwise.

Priorities

I have no idea how such a system would work, but I don’t think it would be too hard to implement. But several priorities are being ignored here. The priority of the College is to protect its students from violent behavior; they can expel the student. But no system is in place, other than the Police that can prevent the student from purchasing a hand gun, even after the college has deemed his condition fit for attention of a mental health professional, and returning to said college and reigning death on everyone.

Another priority is amiss. That of the gun store. I can hardly imagine the conversation that took place, and cannot imagine that a purchase of a pistol and 3 31 round magazines, I’ll keep coming back to this because it’s astonishing, didn’t pique the cashier’s interest. Was no attempt made to talk to the customer, generate a rapport, discover where he shoots, what he shoots at and why he needs the capacity of 93 rounds on hand at the range ? A few answers to simple questions may have aroused suspicion, but depending on the priorities of the seller, perhaps not.

I must not have a clue, but when I’ve been shooting, the biggest magazine you’re likely to need is 8-10 in a .45 and 13-14 in a 9mm anything more is just greedy, or lazy.

There is no other purpose to a 31 round mag than allowing the shooter to spray a large number of rounds in a short amount of time. What legitimate sporting activity requires this ?

Freedoms

Well, perhaps we need the ability to spray 30 rounds at various desert targets because its fun. We have the freedom to enjoy any activity we may as long as it doesn’t impinge on the rights of others; and we have the right to sell said implement of fun for profit.

I don’t understand gun lovers who are for less hassle when buying a firearm, shorter waiting times and less or no permits. You love guns that much, you respect the second amendment so greatly that you’re willing to make it as easy as buying candy for anyone to get a gun ?

Why ? When guns fall into the hands of the mentally ill, the idiotic and irrational, it only calls gun rights into question. Protecting your rights to own a gun also should extend to a need to see that not every idiot is able to get one.

I’m already hearing the rumbling of the anti-gun crowd, on issues of mental health and gun ownership I stand with them.

What next ?

I read this post yesterday and while it talks about the political climate that may have pushed Loughner over the edge, it also talks about what’s next ? Now that “someone has done something stupid” and looks at another event in history that was a pre-cursor to a time of change in this country.

What kind of country are we changing into ? are we going to use this event as a catalyst for positive change, or like 2 other congressmen that have chosen now to carry weapons, are we going to perpetuate fear and keep the idea that political violence should be the norm ?

Gabrielle is a gun owner, she didn’t have it with her at the event, but knowing she could have had a gun was no deterrent to Loughner. I’m not sure what would have been a deterrent for that disturbed young man.

Are we going to make a drive for it to be socially acceptable that public servants must be armed ? Are we going to have to back up our political decisions not just with facts, figures and results, but with the muzzle of a gun too ? This way lies but one thing, that some will say either one side or the other is really looking for: War.

Left, right, in the end it’s just round and round.

Teach a person to shoot, and they can protect themselves, and possibly those close to them. Teach a person compassion, empathy and understanding, and you protect everyone.

Veggie gardens are coming along, in fact one almost has a dog-fence up now. I planted a new citrus, its an orange/grapefruit hybrid, from seed, there’s one in a neighbors yard that produces like crazy every year. The lemon tree is doing great.

You can see my “greenhouse” also. And my ‘maters are getting nice and big, one of them is even reddening up.

Now this issue is *really* complicated for me. I see myself as an Atheist.  Or an agnostic, it depends if I’m reading sci-fi at the time or not.

What really puzzles me about this issue, and is probably a reflection of my up-bringing in the UK, is that I do not understand the absolute need for a group that self identifies themselves as Atheists. One that feels a need to fight against religions spreading myths in a country that really does have much bigger problems, and much scarier myths that need dispelling.

What a group that positions itself against theism does is justify theism’s existence. It justifies Christianities’ allotment in peoples minds as an actual issue which needs to be debated,that it is another line to be drawn in the sand, another position to be adopted to exploit the right vote from the right constituency. In short, overt Atheism and Theism are The Batman and Joker. Without one, the other one has nothing to bounce controversy off of.

Maybe it’s just the idea of an Atheist’s “club” that irritates me, why do people need to justify their positions with an affiliation ? Now, if a full on witch burning domestic holy war kicked off, I’d be in the trenches with Richard Dawkins and the AA’s, but seriously…

All this billboard campaign reinforces in my mind is that the sheep are under an un-ending unconscious message assault that consists of 99% myth, let alone celebrating the myths of the bible once a year, which in my view is utterly harmless, and exactly the wrong angle to attack Christmas from. If you really want to sour the Christmas mood, don’t buy any Christmas presents, wait, atheist America actually gets in on the economic gift buying frenzy in November/December too ? Damn. (if you have to buy gifts stick to the simple rules – buy useful/educational gifts, buy American and local if possible, I know, terribly boring.)

The masses that are looking for myths to be reinforced or trounced one way or another should be ignoring all billboards, television, newspapers, some textbooks and most if not all conversations involving religion.

If people were renting billboards with effective, meaningful myth dispelling messages they might say some things like these:

You don’t actually live in a Democracy, Merry Christmas.

You’re a member of the Empire, not the Rebellion. Get over it and Happy Holidays! (this one is good bumper sticker fodder)

Pick a war, it’s about oil/gas. Go on, buy the wife and kids a Suburban this Christmas. Just ignore the outside world.

Support terrorism, buy Saudi oil every 5th time you fill your tank. Happy Hannakah !

Help the war economy and keep petro-dollars sailing our way vote Republican.

Keep our government indecisive, weak and pandering to the elites vote Democrat.

Our economy will be fine after a die-off. Stuff those stockings !

You’re not being told the truth, and no, we’re not talking about the bloody bible.

In short, messages pro or con on religion are the least important thing that should be appearing on billboards. But hey, that’s just my narrow minded opinion. (which I can pay a few thousand dollars to stick on a billboard, God Bless America .. shit, wait … !)

Worship dogs and sunshine.

Some characterize TV as an information, entertainment and pleasure source, others as a distraction. It can be, and is all of these things depending on who you talk to, and what you watch.

I gernerally like to say that I don’t watch a lot of TV, truth is I probably don’t by average US standards, but I do watch TV. Local news, dramas and sitcoms. I don’t have cable, and I don’t watch news coverage from national networks, I think anyone who spends most of their day being exposed to a 24hr news cycle online will admit that tuning in to the nightly news is a bit pointless. Oh, and PBS, I always have time for that

The idea I had this morning probably does stem from my love for shows like CSI, The Mentalist, Criminal Minds, Law and Order: Criminal Intent / SVU and NCIS. I’m not a drama junkie, but I do find these shows entertaining and interesting. Americans are exposed to hours of TV drama, its very popular, and I’d like to think that it is on the higher end of the intelectual scale of entertainment on  TV (yeah .. I’m trying to dress up my guilty habit..)

Cut this with the other big “drama” I spend a lot of time studying; peak oil and the energy crisis. Bang, there is the idea, the United States as a whole, and its TV fed public need a popular drama show about peak oil. There are already works of fiction dealing with the future difficulties we are going to face (http://www.amazon.com/Oil-Dusk-Peak-Story-ebook/dp/B002HEX2BQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1290345013&sr=1-1) But nothing on TV in a popular format millions of Americans already know and love.

Right now we might be distracting ourselves with info-tainment, but the source of the cancer can be the medium that brings the delerium lifting cure. I wish I knew how to write a good TV show treatment and propose it to my friends at the networks, but I don’t.

We have cable drama shows about the zombie apocolypse (http://www.amctv.com/originals/The-Walking-Dead/) which I’ll admit is one reason I regret not having cable. This illustrates a great point; Americans already watch TV shows that depict post-apocolyptic worlds, dramas that show a United States in termoil and life that is anything but normal (Jericho, comes to mind, playing on that embedded fear that Americans are trained to have; Nuclear attack)

Why not add a little more realism and truth to the writing of a show, one that actually talks about real issues facing the country ? We’ll call it “After Peak” or “Post Peak” and it will have a rugged anti-hero teaching his kids survival skills, while trying to locate his dead wife’s family in the next state. Something like that … get those creative juices flowing and pitch this one to friends. It’d help if they chair a major network …

Some will say during the pitch “Americans aren’t ready for this kind of TV show”

Sadly, thats the whole point.

October is national energy awareness month.

How we use energy in the next decade and beyond is what will define us as a nation.

For this reason we should discuss oil and the perspectives contained in two recent reports.

The Lloyds 360 Risk Assessment on sustainable energy security for 2010 cites quotes from sources including the IEA (Intl. Energy Agency), US DOE (Dept. of Energy), USEIA (Energy Info. Admin.) and the US Chamber of Commerce all discussing how important a prospect of peak oil is.

One researcher states that “A supply crunch appears likely around 2013 .. given recent price experience, a spike … of $200 per barrel is not infeasible.” The report continues on alternative fuels, shale, natural gas, alternative energies, climate change policy or lack thereof, interrupting investment decisions and is a recommended read. The report is aimed at business leaders and investors.

The US Joint Forces Command Joint Operating Environment (JOE) Report 2010 talks about threats our military will face in the coming decades.

“By 2030, demand is estimated to be nearly 50% greater than today. To meet that demand, even assuming more effective conservation measures, the world would need to add roughly the equivalent of Saudi Arabia’s current energy production every seven years.” (A country in this ball park is Iraq, who’s global output could be 12 MBD [mil. barrels/day]. by 2016)

The JOE report continues to say “By 2012, surplus oil production capacity could entirely disappear, as early as 2015, the shortfall in output could reach nearly 10 MBD”

We are the largest importer of oil standing to be the most sensitive to any shocks in supply. Domestic reserves, in the Gulf or Alaska will be a blip in supply and take 10 years to see any benefit. We use 20m. barrels in a day, domestic shale will not support this level of use, serving only an increase in costs.

This information should be on everyone’s radar, it should inform many decisions. There is too little talk of the price of our addiction to foreign oil, only that we are addicted.

Coming elections present opportunity for us to question our various candidates about their views on our energy future and how best to cushion the energy descent that an oil shock will bring.

One more was added today as the Iraqi oil minister announed that the countries estimated reserves have jumped about 25% (of course this could just be to tempt investment, it could be industry hype)

Al Jazeera – Iraq announces jump in oil reserves http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2010/10/201010462122529481.html

NPR aslo had a segment on the announcement, talking to Ben Lando, Iraq Bureau chief for http://www.iraqoilreport.com/ A site I had only recently discovered myself, for this article: American Base in Basra on front line of oil boom.

Ben said something which rang like a bell through the mist in the closing moments of the segment when asked about exactly how much oil might be out there in the world, some of it we might not know about yet:

<some talking about new technology> “What people will usually say is that the low-hanging fruit is gone, except for in Iraq. Iraq is the last place where there’s a country with massive untapped and even undiscovered oil and gas reserves. Iraq is a place for the oil sector right now, and everything else kind of pales in comparison.” – Ben Lando

Thanks Ben. Thanks a whole lot. Anyone who hears that quote and still thinks we didn’t go into Iraq with some measure of attempting to open up that countries energy reserves is in utter denial.

Dick Cheney crafted the Bush administration’s energy policy, with the “energy task force” (check out the link to a map of Iraqi oil fields in that wikipedia article. Gun.. smoke much ?).

A subscriber to the belief that peak oil theory would come to fruition fairly soon, Dick had an inkling it was about time to create a climate that was more condusive to opening up Iraq.

The Lloyds 360 Risk assesment on sustainable energy security 2010 also talks a little bit about Iraq, calling it the “wild card” of OPEC and stating that the aim is to see 12 million barrels a day exported onto markets by 2016.

So wait, what am I implying here ? with these big fat dots (Like Saddam trading oil exclusively in Euros in 2002) That come around 2016 when presumably Saudi Arabia is growing and perhaps cutting back on its exports, increasing domestic consumption from a giant oil field which has been producing since 1943, and perhaps Mexican oil exports will have declined a bit more etc etc .. (many unknowns and unknowables)

Will we be sucking a bunch of oil from Iraq ? what will those numbers look like ? who will be the big exporters at that point ? Canada, Africa, Iraq ? Venuzuela ? How much more will we be depending on Iraq in 2020-2030 … And will we feel any guilt for ripping that country open, ending the lives of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people 30 years before ? Will we wince at the connection, however small it is, however little we depend on Iraq for our future oil addiction, was it worth it ? We might never know.

This wild tangent was brought to you by a cup of earl grey tea and mcvities digestive biscuits.

Tomorrow I will hopefully be picking up a 1986 Toyota pick up truck. 169k on the clock, rust free, 4spd 22R engine with a little oil in the coolant. Hopefully I can make it home

Pray why spend $950 on this piece of junk ?

It shall become my lifes work for the next (insert optomistic number of years here) to convert it to electric drive.

It’s not the destination, its how you get there.